:: The Dirty S Word ::

You know the word I’m talking about.

Submission. <bleeeeeeech!>

Well, perhaps that’s what a lot of the women are thinking. And perhaps most of the men are like, “Heeeeck, yeah, submission is awesome!!!” At least in the biblical sense.

In Ephesians 5:21-33, Paul gives some marital advice to the church of Ephesus. He writes, “Wives, submit yourselves to your own husbands as you do to the Lord,” and “Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her.” There’s a lot more. You should read it. ;)

So what is the beef with this dirty S word anyways? Why do women hate it so much?

Well, I think it comes down to a few reasons.
1.It denotes inequality and almost a difference in inherent value between a man and a woman, in that the man is given the role of headship. It also seems to counteract the freedoms that women’s rights advocates have worked so hard to achieve. This perspective can be quite demeaning to a woman.

2. When you think of submission, you think of weakness. You think of not having thoughts of your own, or having low self-respect so as to NEED a man to make decisions for you.

3. It is a biblical guideline that has been abused to serve the agendas of many men.

These are good reasons to hate the word, and to even throw out this passage of Scripture…except that we have completely misinterpreted and misused this passage, and for far too long.

When people first meet RJ and I, they probably notice a loud, really fiery, super opinionated, “go-getter” Asian chick with a quiet, mellow, “just-sits-back-and-observes-and-speaks-only-when-necessary” half-white half-whatever (What is he, Ethiopian? Mexican?? Lebanese????) guy. Upon first glance, it would be easy to conclude that I am the pants-wearer in the family, and that RJ is passive. In fact, for our staff entrance interview, the homework we were given was to read a book called Wild Women, Passive Men. You can kind of tell what they thought of us.

Friends, let me assure you once for all that RJ is the head of our family, and I joyfully submit myself (most of the time, hahaha) under his headship.

I used to hate the thought of submission myself. But that was before I fully understood what it really meant.

First of all, let’s just be clear. God created man and woman of equal worth and equal value (Genesis 1:27). We are both made in the image of God, and that is quite a high honor. However, for the sake of order, God has called men to take on the headship role for a family and for a woman to submit to her husband (Ephesians 5:21-33). It would be chaotic with two people in charge, have you ever seen that? These roles do not equate to one person having lesser or more value. And this does not counteract the personal freedoms women have worked so hard to achieve. But I will get to this last point later.

Second, submission is not weakness. On the contrary, submission requires greater control and greater strength than one could ever imagine. In Philippians 2, Paul describes this sort of submission and restraint of power in Jesus, who was fully God and yet submitted himself to a fate as humiliating as death on a cross. Jesus wasn’t weak. He wasn’t a pushover or a pansy. He didn’t just let Himself be crucified. Jesus was controlled, determined, knew his mission, and carried it through to the bitter end. Submission is not weakness. It is a conscious decision to yield your power for the sake of something greater.

Thirdly, it’s true. Men have been abusing this passage of Scripture to serve their own agendas for centuries. And because of that, submission has become the dirty S word, a word that women have come to hate. It seems to me that women are more likely to be reminded to submit because “God said you’re supposed to submit to your husband” than men are reminded to love their wives. Or perhaps it is easier to say, “Yeah, I do love my wife. I have fond and fuzzy feelings towards her. I love her so much.”

But what if men actually lived out the command to love their wives as Christ loved the church in the way that Ephesians 5:21-33 really lays out? What if a man not only had fond fuzzy feelings towards his wife, but considered her needs before his own, cared for her as if she were his own body, heck, would be willing to DIE to what he wanted for her good?

In the words of Phil Robertson from Duck Dynasty, “Now we’re cooking with peanut oil!”

You see, the only way this passage can work is if both sides are doing what they are supposed to be doing. Even though I am an obnoxious, VERY opinionated (and expressive, haha), strong, independent woman, I KNOW that in every decision we make as a family,

1. RJ is actively seeking God,

2. He is always open to hearing my (MANY) opinions,

and 3. He makes the final decision for the best interest of our family, even if it means dying to himself and his desires.

And you see, this is how biblical submission does not undo the personal freedoms women have gained in expression. Up until the final say so, I am very much an equal participant in the discussion, whose (MANY…notice a theme?) opinions have equal value and weight, and an active collaborator in the decision making process. And I know that he really listens to and weighs what I have to say about the matter. I am not at the mercy of a selfish man.

And because of these reasons, I can joyfully submit to his headship. RJ really makes it quite easy to do so. And he’s fun too. And handsome.

If you are married, your spouse is part of God’s plan for you. We are called as wives to submit to our husbands and as husbands to love your wives sacrificially. It is not “I will only submit if he loves me sacrificially.” There’s no conditional statement in the passage. You are just supposed to do it, unless it presents a danger to yourself or any others. Then you need to GTFO for the time being and seek some professional help.

But if you are single, dating, or even engaged, one of the things that I cannot stress enough with the young women I meet with is the power of discernment and the power of choice that you have right now. You don’t HAVE to submit to your boyfriend yet, but if you can’t see yourself doing so now (either because you don’t trust that he listens to and obeys God or because you don’t sense that he is looking to the ways to best serve you or the relationship, even if it means sacrificing what he wants), you probably won’t be able to when you are married. Just being honest.

And for you unmarried young men, we are always called to die to ourselves for the sake of another. That is a given, in marriage and out of marriage. And yet while loving sacrificially, if you get the sense that your girlfriend doesn’t really respect you or your leadership in the dating relationship, she probably won’t respect your headship in marriage either. Just saying.

And I’m not saying to you unmarried men and women that your sig o’s need to have this submission and sacrificial love thing all down while you are dating. But the following are just some weeding out questions I would ask before you consider marriage: “Does my sig o listen to God and try to obey Him?” “Do I see in my sig o the potential for growth in _____ (submitting to me or loving me sacrificially)?” and for you unmarried ladies out there, “Do I trust that my sig o walks with God and could I place myself under his headship as he walks with God and obeys Him?”

These are tough questions to ask, but I guarantee you, you would rather be single than wish you were. Waiting for God’s best is truly worth it.

So let’s change the reputation of submission, shall we?? :)

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12 responses to “:: The Dirty S Word ::

  1. Alice, this is a very well-articulated explanation of this interpretation of these passages. Hope you don’t mind my two cents though on a different perspective. Sam and I have a different take on Ephesians 5 — mainly that we start from Eph 5:21, “Submit to one another, out of reverence for Christ.” In our marriage, we talk about mutual submission. We both feel called to submit to one another. Neither of us hold the trump card for final decision-making. We say that Christ is the “head” of our household, not Sam. And though it seems like that would mean that no one is in charge or two people are in charge and therefore chaos might ensue, it’s actually not very chaotic at all. In the same way that you guys discuss everything, we discuss everything too. And at the end of the discussion, we make a decision together — in submission to Christ — not Sam. It’s worked so far!! :)

    Also, in case you’re interested, I wrote a short series on my blog about this topic too. :) It starts here: http://scratchpaperthoughts.wordpress.com/2010/04/30/an-unhappy-extreme/

  2. RJ and Alice

    Hey MaryAnn! :) Thanks so much for reading this post and for commenting! I always really value what you have to say. :)

    You know, as I was reading through your comment and your blog posts on the topic, I actually came to the conclusion that our interpretation of these passages and that our thoughts on the topic are quite similar, with the deviating point being the physical headship of the man in the marriage (Christ the head is a given, of course).

    I completely agree with your first two points of mutual submission and Christ the head in your comment, which though I did not explicitly express, I tried to demonstrate throughout my post. Maybe I could have directly expressed that better, haha. I did think about digging deeper into the idea of “submitting to one another out of reverence to Christ” in verse 21 (which I do reference), because I also really do believe this is a major starting point for this topic. Instead, I relied on my examples to demonstrate this point, and maybe it became unclear.

    I also agree with the points in your blog posts about the husband and wife being equal contributors in the decision making process, the abuses of the role of headship by men in the past, the helplessness and frustration that many women may feel by having their desires, opinions, and thoughts constantly “trumped” by a man’s “headship,” and the freedom from oppression Jesus came for. I am totally on board with these points.

    My hope in writing this post was to paint a picture of the beautiful redemption Christ offers for a system that has been widely abused and misused in the past, based on the foundation of Christ the head and mutual submission to one another. You see, as RJ and I seek God individually and together on issues that arise in our marriage, I can also rest in knowing that RJ is genuinely looking to my best interest, as well as the best interest of our family. And there is true freedom in that, in the same way that there is true freedom in resting in the goodness of God. God doesn’t set up oppressive systems, but mankind perverts it to become oppressive.

    Anyways, like I said, I really do believe we are on the same page with most of these points, and I’m really thankful for your insights and sharing your blog posts on the topic, because I really do believe that at some point, people need to investigate for themselves what they truly believe about the topic instead of just blindly accepting the things they have been told for so long.

    Thanks for commenting and sharing, MaryAnn! Like I said, I really appreciate you and the wisdom you have to offer. :) And I would be really interested in hearing what you have to say about Ephesians 5:21-33 as a whole!

  3. Hi Alice, Thanks for taking the time to respond. I definitely agree that God doesn’t set up oppressive systems, but humankind often perverts what he has set up. :) I think, for the most part, we and our peers have mutually submissive marriages. (Sounds like you and RJ have that in a wonderful way — which makes me very happy.) Others who interpret the passage with a “male headship” per the definition you described, however, don’t end up with a mutually submissive marriage in application. That would be an example of the “perversion” of what God desired and designed for the marriage partnership — and that makes me sad!

    Re: what I think about Eph. 5:21-33 — how much of the series did you read? Did you read all 7 posts? I think I covered all those verses (in broad strokes) over the course of the 7 entries. Let me know what else you were wondering about in terms of my interpretation of the passage.

  4. RJ and Alice

    Hahaha, okay, I see what happened. I followed the link to your second post and then there weren’t links to subsequent posts so I just figured that your series only had two posts. Let me take a read and I’ll let you know if I have any more questions! :)

    And yes, I completely find it repulsive and sad when I hear stories of men who throw in the “headship” card to get what they want. Absolute bullshit (for lack of a better word, and excuse my language, haha) and absolutely abusive.

  5. Alice-thanks for sharing! I really enjoyed reading this summary of your view on “the dirty s word” and happen to agree with the way you guys approach this.

    However, one question that I’ve heard from people who either disagree or just don’t understand is “that’s all nice in theory, but how does it PRACTICALLY work? I hear you talking the talk-how has walking the walk gone?” You lay out the steps you and RJ take, but don’t have much in the way of actual examples.

    Would you mind sharing one or two examples of actual decisions you and RJ have made-maybe one where you two didn’t agree or at least went back and forth for a bit? I think it could be beneficial to those who still have questions even after hearing a fairly straightforward and no-nonsense explanation like you gave here. Thanks!! :)

  6. RJ and Alice

    Josh!!! I love that you read my blog post!! :) And you bring up an absolutely great point that I can’t believe I forgot to address…what does this look like practically?

    I will give you a couple of examples. The first is a silly example, but it has to do with our dog. :) When we were getting Daisy, we spent a couple of evenings with the litter trying to decide which dog to get. I wanted a feisty one, and RJ wanted the ugliest one that we called “Possum Face.” Well we quickly ruled out the feisty dog cuz we were afraid it’d be annoying, but RJ still really wanted “Possum Face.” The problem was, “Possum Face” didn’t like me and wouldn’t come to me at all. But she just loved cuddling with RJ, who was apparently the only person she would cuddle with up till that point, according to the owner. Knowing that this was going to be both of our dog, and as attached as he was to “Possum Face,” I told him that I would be fine with “Possum Face.” But in the end, he made the final decision to go with a completely different dog, the only other dog who would approach me. The little spaz we call Daisy. This was an opportunity for him to just pick the dog he really wanted, but he really wanted to consider me as well. So he decided to die to his desires to serve me. And we are so blessed by our dog because of it.

    A second example is one that we run into quite a bit. Since RJ comes from a culturally white family and I come from a very collectivistic family, we often spend ALL of our holiday break with my family. RJ loves my family, but he also loves and values the family that the two of us have together and wants us to spend time at home alone as our family. He could easily just tell me we are going home, but we discuss it and he takes into consideration that it is important to my family, that it is important to me, and that there are certain cultural obligations that I can’t fully explain but are there. And I know he wants to go home and I want to meet him in that too. But he makes the final decision as a family to stay, having considered our discussion and choosing to die to his own desire, even though he’d rather go home.

    Sometimes, if we are deciding whether or not to commit to an event, I may point out that we should go to support whoever, and we may disagree about what to do. In the end, RJ may ultimately decide as a family not to attend the event, not because it is what he desires but also because he knows that it is best for me in terms if capacity. And usually, I come to appreciate the decision he has come to make for our family, in looking for my best interest, even when I’m not aware of what is in my best interest.

    These are just a couple examples of the ways this dynamic works in our relationship. I don’t think there have been too many standoffs, and usually we end up on the same page. But when we do disagree, I can rest in knowing he isn’t looking out just for himself but also our family, and seeking God while doing so.

    Again, thanks for reading Josh, and for asking for examples! I appreciate it. :)

  7. RJ and Alice

    Hey MaryAnn! :)

    I had a chance to read through some of your subsequent posts. They were thought out well and I appreciate the research and time you have put into them!

    I don’t necessarily agree that the way in which I have described “male headship” in my post is a perversion of the system God desired and designed for marriage. It could easily end up that way in the hands of sinful and unrepentant people, but as each person seeks God, are open with one another with their hearts and desires, and are mutually submissive to one another, I still believe male headship works. It works well for RJ and I. Similar to how we can rest under God’s headship in knowing that He always acts according to our best interest, I can rest knowing RJ does the same. Now granted, he isn’t God and he will make mistakes and act out of selfishness sometimes, and I’ll be selfish and demand my own way, but learning from our mistakes and learning to die to self is just all a part of growing more Christ like, isn’t it? And I’m really vocal when it comes to oppression or issues of inequality. He’ll know if I don’t feel heard. Hahaha.

    I really love the picture you paint of the Greek origins for the word “head,” that like the head of a river, the head of a relationship fills and empowers those below them. What a powerful picture of how the head of a relationship should be taking care of those below them! However, in looking at original meaning of the word, I also think that it only covers an aspect of headship and that “head” also encompasses authority and leadership. This isn’t a cultural misinterpretation that our age has assigned, but I still see these aspects of “headship” in it’s original biblical meaning and context.

    Again, thanks for sharing your posts with me! It gave me a lot to think about. I really do believe we are on the same page with most of our beliefs. It’s only at the end where we deviate, but that’s totally fine if that’s where God has led us. I’m thankful that God gives us that freedom. :)

  8. Hi Alice, Thanks for following up!! I really appreciate the tone of this conversation and your openness to hearing my thoughts with such graciousness and humility. I’ve had a lot of conversations with folks where they were unwilling to read a different interpretation because they were set on theirs and were set on believing that there was only one biblical way to interpret that passage. I definitely think there is more than one biblical way to interpret the passage. You stated one of the ways very clearly in your blog post and hopefully, I was able to post another biblical interpretation clearly. That being said, after reading your last response, I realize there may have been a misunderstanding in something I wrote earlier. I really hope you don’t think that I meant that your interpretation of headship was a perversion of Scripture — that was not what I wrote or meant — I was only agreeing with your idea that sometimes people pervert what God intended. I was also suggesting that people have interpreted that passage with a similar definition of headship and ended up applying it in a way that truly misrepresents God (no mutual submission for each other, being domineering, oppressive, abusive, etc.).

  9. RJ and Alice

    Ohhhhhhh my goodness MaryAnn, I totally got ya. Hahahaha. I was so confused because I thought you were saying that the way I wrote it out in my actual blog post was a perversion of Scripture, and I was like, I thought I wrote it clearly but maybe I didn’t. But I think you were referring to my response to one of your comments. Hahaha, wow. Thanks for clarifying, I appreciate that. And I wasn’t offended and didn’t think you thought RJ and I had a bad system. I just wanted to make sure you knew I didn’t feel oppressed. Haha.

    Also, I am completely on board with your blog posts in terms of shared household responsibilities. If a woman chooses to be a housewife, that’s good for her. But to say that it’s the biblical duty of a wife, that RJ and I are SO not okay with!!

    You know, I’ve also really appreciated the tone of our conversation. To refuse to examine Scripture and beliefs from multiple viewpoints and enter into healthy discussions is a travesty, and quite honestly, is the stuff cults are founded upon.

  10. Oh, I just read this article (http://www.cbeinternational.org/?q=content/2013-1-24-man-and-woman-or-husband-and-wife-arise-e-newsletter), and the following paragraph was relevant to our discussion:

    “The standard LSJ Greek Lexicon does not list “authority” or anything like it as a possible meaning among its forty-eight figurative translations of kephale. LSJ does, however, list various instances where kephale means “source”…”

    If the Greek Lexicon does not list “authority” as a possible meaning for kephale (which is translated ‘head’ in our English Bibles), then why do we read the idea of authority into this word?

  11. BTW, phew, so glad we cleared up the misunderstanding!! Also, glad that you guys believe in shared household responsibilities. This is definitely not true of every household, Christian or nonChristian. Women just end up doing double the work — whether they work at home or in an office!!

  12. Pingback: :: 31 Days in Review :: « What’s On My Mind Grapes?

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